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askwhy Wrote:
Ok, you got me. I have to admit that he has not been arrested since his last conviction/sentencing on JULY 11, 2008 that I know of. Since that is only 3 days, it is a little too soon to tell. The point is that when he was out on his many numerous priors, he continued to commit crimes. Maybe you would like to explain how he only got time served (~9 months) for two felonies - shooting into a car and agg assault with brass knuckles with injuries to the victims) and two misdemeanor convictions, or are you okay with concurrent 4 year sentences with no additional time for these violent crimes?


Well, since how he will perform on probation is yet to be determined in this particular case, and you really don't know if he has committed a new crime then the above statements you made were false.

Now, to explain how he got what he did I certainly can't but I am sure if you call the District Attorney's Office they can tell you why the plea deal was struck.

You see, most of this involves a plea bargain being agreed upon by all parties, not just a judge. The lawyers evaluate how good the case is, what they can prove, and determine the crime to be plead to under the lesser included offenses to which he was indicted. Grand Juries notoriously over indict to allow for this process to happen.

askwhy Wrote:
"Well, since how he will perform on probation is yet to be determined in this particular case, and you really don't know if he has committed a new crime then the above statements you made were false."

If you read what I said was " Duh - new arrest for crimes on May 20th 2008 was since he got out of jail on previous crimes would be a "new crime". " and there is nothing false in that statement. I was noting that while he was out of jail awaiting sentencing, he committed additional crimes. You can continue to defend him as much as you like. And when he gets arrested again - and he will - I will be the first to say you were wrong again!


Hey hoss, I'm not defending anybody. I am questioning your ability to understand that we don't know if probation is a failure in this case or not. To date it is not, thus saving tax payer money. I am defending saving taxpayer money. You advocate spending it.

What you did say is "And he is back out to immediately resume his life of crime - which he does."
Well, he hasn't as of this moment.

askwhy Wrote:

Jacket Wrote:

askwhy Wrote:
"Well, since how he will perform on probation is yet to be determined in this particular case, and you really don't know if he has committed a new crime then the above statements you made were false."

If you read what I said was " Duh - new arrest for crimes on May 20th 2008 was since he got out of jail on previous crimes would be a "new crime". " and there is nothing false in that statement. I was noting that while he was out of jail awaiting sentencing, he committed additional crimes. You can continue to defend him as much as you like. And when he gets arrested again - and he will - I will be the first to say you were wrong again!


Hey hoss, I'm not defending anybody. I am questioning your ability to understand that we don't know if probation is a failure in this case or not. To date it is not, thus saving tax payer money. I am defending saving taxpayer money. You advocate spending it.

What you did say is "And he is back out to immediately resume his life of crime - which he does."
Well, he hasn't as of this moment.


Well, probation didn't seem to work before with him. What you don't understand is the difference between someone who is committing crimes and someone getting arrested for crimes. They are not the same. You may be so pollyanna as to believe that ORPD arrests everyone who commits a crime in OR, but the truth is you can make hundreds of drug sales before you make the one that gets you arrested. Please show us your reasoning/proof that these guys have turned into production citizens while on probation or out awaiting trials. I contend the evidence is there for the opposite view. Ask any of the street officers. I believe that Clark has started a new day and these guys who got picked up Friday will be examples of aggressive prosecution and we might get some real jail time for them if the judges do their part.


I can't show you in this particular case as the probation is still in effect and he has not either been discharged or revoked from his sentence. Clark's office made the deal that got this guy on probation with approval of Judge Elledge. It is a part of normal operating procedure, neither good or bad, just the way things are handled. Time only tells in these instances.
What part of all parties, DA/Defense Attorney/Judge in the striking of a plea agreement don't you understand? Judges do their part.

Blowin Smoke Wrote:

askwhy Wrote:
The other issue is how screwed up our justice system is if someone has the opportunity to get arrested 20 times without any convictions. So much for speedy trials. It is a big problem locally that you have people getting caught a number of times before the first case ever comes to trial.


They got arrested 20 times without conviction because RAMSEY was in office.

When the last time you made an arrest and had all the facts in order for a conviction?

Apparently YOU don't know the system as well as you claim you do. Hmph. Imagine that.


askwhy Wrote:
...I believe Clark when he says these will stick and they are all felonies.


And suddenly you became a believer!?!?!?

I sure wish I had YOUR job. Most people get paid to WORK for a living. Bet your boss wouldn't be happy to know that you're chit-chatting all day.

Heh - "any job"...

You're funny, yet sad.

Tongue
Maybe the pleas are going down because officers like you claim to be did not dot their I's and cross their T's. There are many reasons why cases are plead. Under the new administration less are getting plead out. The numbers are higher as far as cases brought to the DA. Grand Jury is working double time.
And are you saying our DA's office doesn't do that?
There are trials in Anderson Co. and every other County in the State of Tennessee, there his a huge one in Roane County now with former Criminal Judge Scott being the trial judge. However, plea bargaining is an extremely important tool. Without it the courts would have a much larger backlog of cases than it does now. A good DA knows the case, makes the appropriate office, and a good defense attorney knows the same and will accept if his/her client is willing. Just in Anderson County it is not humanly possible for the one judge that handles Criminal Jury trials to try all the cases. With help from the Chancellor it still would be impossible. Further, trials are extremely expensive when the end result would be very similar to what a plea would render.

JustMe Wrote:

Jacket Wrote:
There are trials in Anderson Co. and every other County in the State of Tennessee, there his a huge one in Roane County now with former Criminal Judge Scott being the trial judge. However, plea bargaining is an extremely important tool. Without it the courts would have a much larger backlog of cases than it does now. A good DA knows the case, makes the appropriate office, and a good defense attorney knows the same and will accept if his/her client is willing. Just in Anderson County it is not humanly possible for the one judge that handles Criminal Jury trials to try all the cases. With help from the Chancellor it still would be impossible. Further, trials are extremely expensive when the end result would be very similar to what a plea would render.


I'm saying in general that criminal justice system has been greatly abused by trial lawyers and judges allow people (like the Houstons in Roane County to put on a circus)...Not necessarily picking on Anderson Co, but the trial courts in general...My post specifically mentioned one of the Shannon Christian murderers (yes he's guilty) who had his trial postponed for another year.



Then maybe you should be more clear in your presentation. And yes there is a danger of a trial becoming a "circus" whatever that means.

So, how do you take lawyers and judges out of the criminal justice system? Answer: you don't.

JustMe Wrote:
Right, lawyers and liberal judges continue to get the creeps back on the street before one can blink...Screw the victim's rights...


The State of Tennessee has a Victim's Bill of Rights in the Constitution. I like that slur again, Liberal, whatever that means. You have never sat in a court room and seen how the process works, keep reading the news though. No bias there at all. LMAO.

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